New series is here: Momentum! Beech, Birch and Maple shell options!

[tcbetka]

Jules would be a much better person than I to opine on this, given our respective experience levels with Sonor in general. However from what I can tell, SQ2 isn't going anywhere any time soon. I mean, why would it? It's a line that allows you to build a completely bespoke drum set basically, using anything Sonor has to offer. What would they change that to?

Your arguments about the color/finishes of the Momentum series, and about some of the depths of the drums, might have some validity. That said though, I think history has taught us that Sonor will ADD to the line going forward. So in terms of what that means for the Momentum line, I don't see a real cause for concern. Quite the opposite really. I think 2-3 years from now (or less, possibly), there will be more finishes. As to the drum dimensions...I don't know about that. Again, Jules would be better on that topic than I.

[Wayne]

I have this bad feeling that this series may end up sitting in a warehouse waiting for people to buy them. I don’t see the enthusiasm from me or the rest of the Sonor faithful. Those 150th super expensive vintage series kits will be siting in their warehouse for years. They are ugly. Give us was we want Sonor. The new flagship series to replace sq2.

What’s wrong with the SQ2? (Other than the tom mounts)

[Hazelwood7]

Tom,

I see and appreciate your points. Thankfully I don’t run a drum company. I love Sonor and think it’s the best drum I have ever played. So I hope I am wrong and that they continue to be very successful.

Maybe with the SQ2, I want an update. They need more options and better mounting options. I will explain after owning 4 sq2 kits, in my opinion they need more on the h mount. It’s just clunky. The way that the mount attaches to the tom arm is very awkward. Depending on how you want to clamp it down, the tom at certain angles will bump against the tone control knob. It makes it difficult to get it into the right angle. The mount bar itself is too short. The Prolite mount id better but still not perfect on this front. The Prolite mount is superior because it does not have the control knob, which over time will beak as the abs plastics gets brittle and breaks. Just like thre Designer. Sonor stopped making Designer parts and thank God for St Drums or there would be no replacement parts. I can get the sq2 replacement parts through them as well. I never tension the tone knob for this reason.

They need to make hardware that won’t break due to design flaws. The Prolite mount has a bolt there so that won’t happen.

The sq2 mount has too much ABS plastic gaskets on it, which makes the mount heavier then it should be. This causes chocking at certain angles. If you are going to make a super high end Drumset it should not have this issue. The rocket launcher is an amazing bass drum mount. It’s just too heavy to lug around. The T bar is a step down in functionality. They could redesign the rocket launcher to be made with lighter metal material or build a a better t bar.

I would like the choices sq2 to get Prolite mounts or the mounts from the sq1.

I should be able to get the prolite level of abs gaskets which makes the drums lighter. I should have a choice between the cheaper t rods and the more expensive round knobs.

They stopped coming out with new finishes several years ago. Still waiting for red stain to come back.

Some of these choices will drop the price of the kit in the configurator.

I want the shell thickness choice for signature and phonic shells.

With the all the price increases over the years, they need to show some improvements here. It’s been the same since 06. They did add the beautiful prolite strainer but not much else I hardware upgrades. So it’s been almost 20 years.

I can’t afford these prices now, and I am their prime market. Or more importantly, why would I continue to buy a new SQ2 today when in 2012 I got my sq2 kit, it was almost half the price. So paying double today for what I got for half price with no improvements is not really a good option just because I want a new finish. There has been 19 years of the used market. Give me some reason to buy a new one. I think the Prolite sound better than a vintage maple sq2 because the Prolite is more open sounding drum. So I expect the momentum series to do the same thing. There is a possibly that the momentum series sounds better then the sq2 counterparts since they removed all the heavy hardware.
Chris

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[tcbetka]

I saw this in your other thread, and responded to it there. All I can say is that you and I value different things in a kit at this point. Neither is right, and neither is wrong. It just is what it is. And no matter WHAT Sonor releases (in terms of a new line), someone is always going to have a complaint(s) about that new line. Human nature.

Nothing wrong with that.

[Hazelwood7]

Tom, you make a great point. People want different things in their Drumsets and there is no one way. I appreciate you engaging me in a great discussion about drums that we love.
Chris

[Jules]

The SQ2 configurator is a complex beast. Also, changes and upgrades have to be done by a 3rd party and are costly. And as I understand it, each seemingly little change has huge impacts across the board with calculating pricing, generating UPIDs, and all other aspects of functionality.

MAYBE with potential AI integration, the day will come where you can ask for the Vintage hardware and/or hoops, metal shell snare drums and have options for other mounts and all of that. But, every single metal part requires a separate piece of tooling, and THAT is very costly, as well. So, the day you have the option of several styles of lugs, 2 or 3 mounting options, whatever other variables you can conjure up probably isn't coming.

Things are much different being inside looking out that visa versa. Think about your career. Think of the opinions people have about how to run your company or do your job better. Why don't companies change their business practices whenever someone has a better idea? That's rhetorical and I am not going go down that rabbit hole, there's no point. I think we all get it.

The big picture here is that Sonor is a for profit company. And not one that runs on nostalgia, at that. Not that that was the point necessarily, but there ARE many people that would like Sonor to stay stuck in the 70's or 80's, and that works for some companies, to a degree, but Sonor was never about 'running on the name" or resting on their laurels.

The Designer Series was the first drum series from a large manufacturer where you could spec out a wide variety of options. Sure, there were boutique builders that could take custom building beyond even that, but on a large scale the Designer was ground breaking. The SQ2 was a step beyond even that, putting the buyer in control of building up the options in a configurator that allows you to see a semi-realistic rendering of your configuration and select from all the options. This eliminated a problem with the Designers. I took Designer specs over the phone or in emails and that left lots of opportunity for error in ANY step along the way, on the customers end, my end, with the distributor or when it was relayed to factory. SQ2 also eliminated some parts that were prone to failure, which some people feel like took away some of the functionality and identity.

SQ2 has been on the market for a considerable amount of time, now. Playing armchair quarterback, I think we will see some expansions and new offerings here and there until in the years to come, an AI drum modeling platform is unveiled, that simplifies offering more finishes, more fades and burst on available finishes and so on. Keep in mind, Sonor DOES accept special requests on SQ2 drums, you just have to talk to your dealer to get details and pricing hammered out.

All that said, Sonor still have to stay within reasonable boundaries to maintain profitability. And they seem to be doing fine in that department, as we would all hope. Will they ever be able to let us choose from shapes of lugs, mounts, hoops, and whatever else? Well, who knows. Technology is really ramping up. Things are rapidly evolving and who knows what tomorrow holds. One thing seems pretty certain to me, though...

If you look at the fact that Sonor has been a trend setter in the past with Signature, Designer and other things, you can halfway explect that they will be the ones to bring the next major innovation to the market!

[Hazelwood7]

I understand from a business point and what you are saying. I disagree though that always caring about the bottom line is also a weakness. You take less chances and you end up playing it safe. Your reputation is how you got here and it was built on being innovative. Sonor can stilll say that they have best shells in the business snd are the tops on how awesome they sound.

I love the 70’s and 80’s kit. They are such a high bar and w were way ahead in how they built and did everything. We could talk about how it got too expensive to manufacture those drums and it was sold at a time when the industry was changing.

But the biggest issue about those sets were the mounting didn’t allow the shells to really ring well and that they were too damn heavy.

So the Designers were created that were new and innovative. They took the old rims mount concept and made their own and it was a system that allowed the shells to vibrate freely. They were also slightly less heavy.

I remember looking at buying my first Sonor Designer kit but hearing stories from other folks who had that issue about Sonor screwing up your order because everything was written down. People were dissatisfied and it was a real barrier to ordering those drums so I waited for the sq2 configurator to come out.

It was new and innovative at the time. The drums were lighter and the refinements to the mounting systems made the drums sing more. So I ordered my kit and got exactly what I wanted.

But other companies copied Sonor and did the same things . Then masterworks comes along and really increased the customization options. I never been a big fan of Pearl but I wish the sq2 program was that extensive.

Yes cost of German labor is super expensive and that’s how it will be moving forward forever. But Sonor says that a new hardware line is too expensive to make due to tooling cost. I think Sonor is now the only brand of drum that DOES NOT offer lacquer finishes anymore on their pro line of production drums. Every other major drum company has some type of lacquer finishes offered on their pro level kits. Prolite was it….

Sonor says that lacquering is too expensive and time consuming so to keep the price reasonable we can’t do that anymore.

But we have the best sounding shells…..

Sometimes playing it safe, has a downside. If you listen to them what they are saying that they can’t compete with other companies on the market because it’s too expensive to do so. They may only work for do long. It’s new leadership. The history of Sonor is innovation and trend setting. Don’t divorce yourselves from your core principles because money is a problem. Money will always be a problem. But loosing your core philosophy and going a different direction may make it a much more costly mistake. I hope they don’t realize that spending the R&D up front will help them to maintain that reputation and they will kick themselves because the future loses far outway the short term goal of staying profitable.
Chris